ENP STAFF REPORTS
news@eastniagarapost.com

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East Niagara Post co-publishers Heather Grimmer and Scott Leffler sat down recently with local law enforcement officials to discuss domestic violence. Niagara County Sheriff Jim Voutour, Lockport Police Chief Larry Eggert, Anita Provenzano and Doug Haak shared their thoughts with us on this very important issue. The question-and-answer session follows below.

SCOTT LEFFLER: Some very very simple basics. And this goes to the heads of each department. Well, not necessarily. But I wrote this question towards the heads of each department. Does your office have a policy or theory on how to handle domestic violence cases?

DOUG HAAK: It comes from New York State.

JIM VOUTOUR: It's New York State protocol.

SL: Which is?

DH: Pro-arrest policy. If there's a crime that is committed, an arrest is made.

LARRY EGGERT: Actually, the county and the city of Lockport, were the first to use the policy. We've been doing this for quite a while.

SL: If I recall correctly, it had a lot to do with the Simpson/Brown case — O.J. Simpson.

LE: That was the trigger. It was on the radar, but then it really got moving.

SL: I guess that leads to my next question, which is that oftentimes domestic violence cases are "he said / she said." How do you get to the root of the matter and separate fact from false claim.

DH: Our officers are specifically trained to have interview questions that can distinguish initial aggressor. That's what the state's looking for. Sometimes it is "he said/she said" and we have to use our basic interview skills to be able to decide who's telling the truth and who isn't. The system seems to be working at that point. And if there is enough evidence after our interviews, an arrest is made.

SL: There was a case a couple weeks ago maybe, in which a male was arrested for, I don’t know whether it was harassing or assaulting a female. No. It was the female that was arrested first. And then a couple days later, the male was charged with almost an identical crime. Does that happen a lot? Obviously, I don't want to get into names but are you familiar with what I'm talking about?

DH: It doesn't. Very very rarely does it because there's alway an initial aggressor. Someone's always the first one to initiate something. Order of protections are given immediately after an arrest. It depends on the severity of the crime, but our judge is on board with us. He automatically issues an order of protection. Whether or not the victim wants it or doesn't. It's automatic. So in the case of the scenario that you're giving, it could have been that he showed up and did something back to her or it could have been a retaliatory thing. It could have violated an order of protection. Two days later, doesn't necessarily mean he was arrested based on the first initial thing. I'm just speculating.

JV: It's actually rare that both get arrested.

SL: On the issue of an order of protection. That goes both ways, right? If Sheriff Voutour has an order of protection against me and he shows up at my door, can he be charged with violating an order of protection?

JV: It's specifically, there's a petitioner and a defendant.

SL: If he shows up at my door, can I be charged with violating an order of protection?

JV: That's too broad of a question.

SL: Well let's change the setting - we're in a public place.

DH: The defendant has knowledge of the order of protection?

SL: Correct.

DH: If you're in a public place, he or she has an obligation to leave immediately or face being charged.

SL: What constitutes a public place?

JV: Anything that not private. A home is private.

SL: Is a business private?

JV: A business is private, but that can be construed as a public place if its open to the public to come into.

SL: Does it get gray?

JV: It can, but, for the most part, we're pretty smart guys. We can figure out what's public and what's private. Keep in mind that ... we pretty much do the same things with domestics. One difference I want you to be aware of is I deal with 28 town judges who all have different opinions and protocols. Well, not protocols. But they do things different. I don't have judge Watson or Judge DiMillo every time. I might have someone in Barker and the next day I might have someone in the Town of Niagara. We're dealing with different judges.

SL: Different judges look at things differently?

JV: just like cops look at things different. Just like you might look at a story and say 'that's going to be a great story' and Heather might say 'Scott, that story stinks.'

SL: You’d be surprised how often that happens. (laughs) She is right 90 percent of the time.

JV: So, you know, judges are unique. They're unique people. That's why in the towns, they're elected officials. In the city too, of course.

SL: Do you know … not know … well, no. When arresting someone, 'Oh crap, this is going to go before "x" and he's going to get nothing or he's doing to get out. Or she. I don't mean to be discriminatory in my explanation here. But when you arrest someone in a specific township, for example, and you know what judge it's going to go to, without trying to get you in trouble here, do you sometimes wish it would end up somewhere else?

DH: We don't have that issue because we deal strictly with the District Attorney's office.

LE: A lot of the more serious cases go to the county.

JV: Any felonies ...

ANITA PROVENZANO: Really, Scott, no one's going to say that ...

SL: Fair enough.

AP: I mean there are certain judges that ...

SL: I didn’t ask you to name judges.

AP: I mean, there are certain ones that are more lenient.

DH: We go right through the District Attorney's office. so as far as a judge, how we do it in the city of Lockport ... we go through the district attorney's office. They make recommendations and then that goes before the judge. And then the district attorney decides how they want to proceed. It's been a system that is really well looked at. And then if it is very serious, it goes right up to the county anyway. To the county prosecutors that handle the felonies and the really serious ones.

LE: They do a good job screening and taking cases ...

JV: Bail recommendations sometimes.

AP: And the ADAs actually ask us to forward all the felony charges over there to look at ... anything that's assault or whatever is always forwarded over to teh DA's office.

JV: I guess the point with the town judges is, it's probably safe to say that if you took, let's say, an assault third - a misdemeanor assault - in front of five judges, you could get five different bails. On something more serious like a felony, they're going to call the DA that's on call and get a recommendation on bail. But on any basic assault ... or sometimes a harassment. You're calling a judge at 3 in the morning sometimes. You might get $100 from one judge. You might get $300 from the next. $500 from the next. You might get no bail from another one. It varies. And they have that latitude. They're not doing anything wrong. Again ... Heather likes the story. Scott doesn't like the story. Judges are different. You could get something different between DiMillo and Watson. It's just ... they have that leniency and there's not hard and fast rules for each case. They look at each case for its merits. and that's how they base it.

HEATHER GRIMMER: You mentioned bail. Can you explain what bail is. Because a lot of our readers have no idea what bail is and they think it's supposed to be a punishment.

JV: It's not.

HG: Can you clarify?

JV: It just guarantees an appearance in court. It's that simple.

LE: No matter what the charge.

JV: No matter what it is.

LE: Sometimes we get backlash. "How come they don't have more bail?"

JV: And they always blame the police for that. Someone will do the most egregious crime. Like animal abuse. Animal abuse sells like no tomorrow in the media. They'll set $500 on an animal abuse case. And then they yell at me and Larry on social media "Why isn't the bail higher. What's wrong with these police?" We don't have anything to do with it.

SL: Sometimes you do, though, right? There are instances where there’s police bail. How does that work?

DH: We can set bail based on the criminal procedure law up to certain amounts for anything e-felony down. Usually, what we try to do, I know when I was shift commander, I would set the maximum for the charge based on the criminal procedure law. But ultimately, the judge could come in, do and arraignment and redo my bail. Which often happens.

JV: Happens with us too.

DH: And like we said before, bail is never used as a punitive measure. I, myself tried to be very consistent with my bails, so that no one could say, "well there was personality involved." Or anything like that. If there as a DWI, it was a $500 bail. If it was this it was $250. And I tried to stay very very consistent with my bails so that it took all that personality right out of it. But quite often, some of the things that we dealt with, especially domestics, you're dealing with felonies where we can't set bail. The judge has to be notified. And our court, because of the city, we do have full-time judges. If a domestic incident occurs, we as police officers cannot set bail. Mandatory. It has to be in front of a judge.

JV: Same with us. There's exceptions to everything.

DH: Everything. But the rule of thumb is: Domestic, police officers, supervisors and the chief of police cannot set bail until that person is arraighned before a judge. Or magistrate.

SL: Is that to allow a cooling off?

DH: Basically because of the new protocols that have been instituted since the OJ Simpson incident, our judge, when he come sin, no matter what, will issue an order of protection for our victims. It really has nothing to do with a cooling off period. It has to do with protocols of this individual is going to get served an order of protection that states - there's one of two - a full stay away or a limited order. Full stay away means you can't be around them, kids, homes, owrk, whatever. Or if it maybe a spouse, first time offense - depending on the issue - they may offer a limited order that says that you have to refrain from harassing, stalking, annoying, those kind of behaviors. And that's usually revisited after a six-month period. Or when they go back to court to discuss the state with the victim. If she says, "well, we tried that temporary one, it didn't work out too well for us," then the judge and the district attorney has the ability to bump it up to a full stay away, which can be anywhere from six months to, I've seen as long down the road as a 10-year order of protection. Which is pretty serious.

SL: We’ve both done this Doug. We’ve both used “he” and “she.” And when we've done it, "he" has been the aggressor and "she" she has been the victim. How often is that the case? I know it's not universal, but is that typically the case? Is that still the standard, if you will.

DH: Statistically.

AP: But we are getting more and more male victims.

DH: Maybe 85/15. Maybe even higher. Maybe 90/10

SL: Anita, why do you think there are more male victims? Is it that there are more male victims or that they’re more willing to come forward?

AP: I just think men are withholding. Trying to control themselves and a woman is beating on them, harassing them. And they go to the cops or they call and have the cops intercede to solve the problem. Sometimes it ends up with an arrest if the girl's really hurting them. I mean, some of these girls are wicked when they fight.

DH: Remember, too, Scott, that we live in a different time now where same-sex relationships are prevalent. So when we're talking male victims, it could be a male victim in a relationhips with another man. We live in a whole different time now where society is accepting to this and the laws cover that just as much as it covers a heterosexual relationship. So you've seen a little bit of an increase because of that. Which is a good thing. ANd that came into effect about two year ago under the Cuomo administration where same-sex relationship relatinship are treated with the same protocols as heterosexual relationships.

SL: To be clear, most people, self included, tend to generalize domestic violence as spousal abuse or significant other abuse. But it also includes other familial relations, correct?

JV: Well, it includes children as well. If you beat your kids, that's a domestic. So it's anybody ... it's two people that have a relationship of some form. It always has been that way.

SL: Earlier you mentioned special training that officers undergo. Is that part of police academy? Is that after police academy? Are there checkups? Do they get re-done? What is the training?

DH: We have a specialized unit, I know the Sheriff's department does too, We have a domestic violence unit that oversees, looks at, reviews all of our domestic incident reports. Those officers have gone to specialized training through the state. Through the Department of Criminal Justice Services - on how to deal with, specifically how to deal with victims. How to interview them. Signs to look for. As far the department goes, we've continued to have training over the course of the last 16 years or so. With the changes in the environment, we have evidence-based prosecutions that came into effect a few years back where we don't need a victim to sign a statement anymore. If there's probably cause to believe a crime has occurred, we can make the arrest just based on our own observations. So they're up to speed on that.

AP: Obstruction of breathing.

DH: Obstruction of breathing just came into effect. Once those criminal laws come into effect, the state is very good at sending us not only briefings, but case law to back up the briefings, which we do at our briefing time. We have training at our briefing time just to let the officers know, "here's a new charge. Here's what it constitutes, here's the statute. This is the punishment." And if a victim says, "Yeah, he put his hands around my neck and caused me fear and I couldn't breathe," before that, the charge was harassment. Now it's obstruction of breathing. Now it's a misdemeanor, which is a big difference when we're talking about going to court.

SL: Doug, do you head that unit?

DH: Do I? Yes.

SL: Do you have a title?

DH: To be honest, I just call myself "in charge of the Domestic Violence Unit." I don't give myself a title. I'm just the same as any of the other guys that are working.

SL: Create you have your own police department, you can make your own titles. That’s what we did. Well, not our own police department. But we made our own titles.

DH: No. No. Chief's doing a great job. I'm good.

AP: But we have six or seven officers on the team.

SL: Is there always one on duty?

DH: Most of them because they're older now, most of them are on the day shifts. But we go out at night. We do home visits. We do safety planning. It's the same as the Sheriff's Department. They do the same stuff. Sue LaRosa would tell you the same thing. Each of us model ourselves after each other. We have monthly and quarterly meetings together. So that we're all on the same page. We're all training the same way. So there's consistency. I think that's the big thing. There's consistency among the departments and among the victims. You don't want a victim on Robinson Road in the town saying "Well, the Sheriff's Department did this," and then they moved into the city, "Well you guys do that." We all do the same thing. I mean guys handle calls a little differently but the protocols are all the same.

SL: That leads to one of my questions actually. How is … without BS-ing me because I’m sitting here at the table. How’s the communication between the departments? Because I know that sometimes something will happen in the town. And something else will happen in the city. They're treated differently. Every different officer, despite going to the same training, might view things differently. How do you keep things in line between, not just in the city but from the city to the Sheriff's Department. Do you guys have meetings? Do you get together?

JV: I can tell you that's probably the one thing that we do best. On a county-wide way. They know about all the domestics in the town. We know about all the domestics in the city. All that information gets compiled into one database so if Doug is reviewing a domestic that happened on West Avenue in Lockport, he might see that that couple lived on Robinson Road and had six priors. All of that is compiled.

SL:  Now is that true with all crime or is that specific to domestic?

JV: Just domestics.

SL: Really? Who created that?

DH: The state actually came out with a project to do it. And the county having the most resources to have that database, everything gets filtered through the county. So all of our reports from us, NT, all the cities ...

JV: That includes State Police, city of Niagara Falls, every police agency in this county.

DH: We send our reports directly to them.

JV: We kind of ... I don't want to say retain them all, but we compile them.

SL: Is that available in the car? Or is that something that’s at dispatch?

DH: We have access to it through our dispatch centers.

SL: Okay.

JV: Do you want the 2013 numbers for the county? For domestics.

SL: Yes, I do.

JV: 3,169 domestic violence reports county-wide. Niagara Falls had 1,400. The Sheriff's Office handled 800. Lockport, 230. Again, that's 2013. We don't have 2014's yet.

SL: Lockport was 230?

JV: Lockport was 230. So there is one big database of reports that we call can see. So if we need, again, we can see "I got John Jones here involved in a domestic. He's involved in Barker. He's involved in Niagara Falls. So we can see the history."

DH: And that also works with order of protections. We pull up a name and just because the order of protection was given in Newfane, it doesn't mean Lockport doesn't have access to it if for some reason the parties were at Lock 34, they showed up and they say, 'I got an order of protection.' If we don't have documentation, we can immediately go to the database and find out yes, indeed, there is an active order of protection. And they'll be able to disseminate that information to our units on scene.

JV: And that could be the basis for an arrest.

SL: Sheriff Voutour, do you know how these numbers compare to last year? Steady?

JV: They remain pretty steady. They've always been pretty consistent.

DH: I have our numbers up to September of this year.

JV: Which are?

DH: We have ...until September, we reviewed 475 domestic incident reports, which has led to 173 victims.

SL: When you say 173 victims, does that mean that there have been 173 charges?

DH: There was 173 arrests based on those DIRs. So that's how we kind of distinguish. Because just because we reviewed 475 domestic incident reports, that doesn't mean there's 475 victims because domestics give a lot of repeat business, it could be the same person. The same victim. And anytime, we show up on any call that's considered a domestic, a domestic incident report has to be completed. That's by our protocols made by the state. So there could be multiple DIRs for the same person.

JV: You could also have a domestic where nothing takes place that would be an offense or a crime. Two people may call the police because "she lit a candle and he doesn't want it lit. They get into an argument over the candle. Police get called."

DH: And quite frankly, this quarter is the worst quarter for domestic violence because of Christmas and Thanksgiving. Right around Thanksgiving is our busiest time of the year. And that's consistent in the last 16 years that I've been doing this.

JV: And you also have fights with custody of children. "I get 'em Thanksgiving." "No, you don't." And they get into a fight. That has a lot to do with it, too.

SL: It seems to me just in reading police reports that October was busy in terms of domestic incidents. Did I just happen to notice them more because of it being Domestic Violence Awareness Month? Or was this month … was something weird in people's Wheaties this month?

LE: You get ... for no rhyme or reason ... you'll get one shift with 25 domestics and you'll think "What the heck is going on? Is there something in the water?"

JV: If the Bills lose.

LE: Yeah. It happens.

DH: If the Bills lose, we get fights. We're not joking at all. If you think about it, most the time when you're watching a football game, beverages are being served. And all of the sudden, things didn't go their way. People are passionate about their sports. You're not going to see a humungous fight. But you will see incidents where we are called because the Bills lost. And they will say that. The holiday season is a very tough season. Finances. That has a lot to do with it. You can see it increase, just based on these numbers, for this year. Our numbers are going to be up ... I don't want to say significantly ... but in a double-digit higher percentage than they were last year.

AP: The weather's starting to change. With the colder weather, people are inside a lot more, too. Cooped up people get a lot of arguments going.

SL: You kind of touched on this earlier, but I want to ask it specifically. If someone not directly involved, say a neighbor or someone passing by, calls and says, "hey I hear something in the apartment downstairs, the apartment next door, or the house across the street. Will you guys go check it out?" And they indicate for some reason or another that they feel like it's a domestic incident, but you get there are both parties say they're fine and everything is great, is there anything that can be done? Or are your hands tied?


JV: We've all been on those calls. You're doing you evaluation as you're interviewing if you can even get their door open.

DH: Stop. Listen. You park down the street a little bit. Those are all the tactical protocols. You go there with two man teams. You stop. You listen.

JV: A lot of times, you listen before you go in. It's the key. But everyone is so different, Scott. It's so hard to give you a blanket answer.

SL: It sounds to me like you're saying that there are things that can be done.

JV: If we look through a window and she's got a black eye or we see an assault in progress, they'll probably be lying under a door if they don't open it. We have a duty to act. Or if the door opens and she's standing there with a black eye or bleeding or he's standing there bleeding ...

SL: Now the other side of that is you go to something, you feel like you know what's going on, but there's no physical evidence, there's nothing you can do about it, is there something that you wish that victims of domestic violence knew that they don't? Do you ever wish you could just hand somebody a not discretely and be like 'look, here's a tip for you.'

DH: A big thing that Anita does better than anyone at this table just by the fact that she has a women's group, or victim's group that she has every Wednesday ... and one thing that I've gotten out of it is to tell these individuals that they're not alone. That this is not a unique problem to just them. And I think that that's a big factor because they think that they're alone. They're with somebody for financial reasons or because of a home or because of a job. There's things that can be done.

AP: Watching the children.

DH: The things that come out of people's mouths of why they stay ... because of an animal.

JV: Religious beliefs.

DH: "My parents won't forgive me." Just really really

LE: The sheriff has said it a couple times, it's a different dynamic every time you walk through the door. There's no two that are exactly the same.

AP: And the one thing is, too, you were mentioning sometimes the guys do go look in a window and something's going on, and the girl will deny it. She might have a black eye. And the guys see it, what's going on, sometimes they see them, actually with a weapon or whatever. And I think they need to know that this evidence-based prosecution is new now, isn't it?

JV: It's probably seven or eight years old.

AP: But it's hard ... certain judges ...

LE: Do you know what evidence-based prosecution is?

SL: I think I get the general gist. Is that you can be the plaintiff.

DH: Bad guy. No, we can be the bad guy.

SL: Right.

DH: That's how I look at it.

SL: So the other person doesn't need to press charges.

DH: Correct.

SL: You can press charges on their behalf to an extent.

AP: Like the girl will say, "no, no, no. I'm alright."

DH: You get the 911 call, "oh my God, he's beating me." Click. You get there and "oh, no, that was the kids playing with the phone." And then you see the phone dangling off the wall, she's got marks. The furniture's all in disarray.

JV: Nobody else in the house.

DH: No kids in the house. He's sweating. He's got blood on his knuckles. I mean, those kind of things, we separate, we start taking photos, we start interviewing. And based on the experience of the officers, we make an arrest.

AP: I wish they'd use that more, really, because we do have a lot of that that goes on and they deny it, and there is evidence there. But a lot of the guys, they'll really take a stand on it and say they're going to do it.

JV: It's harder to prosecute because you have a victim that's not willing to testify or give a statement. So it is harder to prosecute ...

SL: You mentioned your group on Wednesdays. Are there enough resources available for victims of domestic violence? Is there enough being done to help after the fact?

AP: Yes, we have a lot of ... there's a lot of support systems.

JV: A ton of 'em.

AP: All over the place. Shelters. There's financial help. There's help with clothes, furnishings for apartments.

DH: Cell phones.

AP: Right, cell phones. We have ...

JV: Panic buttons.

AP: Right. Apartments. Transitional housing for them.

DH: In Niagara Falls, they have a domestic shelter that includes animals if that's an issue for people that have a cat or a dog because, believe it or not, people won't leave their homes if they think they're going to leave an animal behind. So now there's homes that will now take animals ...

AP: There's two main things that I think stand in the way. That is transportation. These mothers, they don't have any transportation to get to job interviews. You know, we try to promote them to go out. I do. To get out and work, they'll feel good about themselves. They're working. They're around people. They're not dependent on DSS. Transportation and babysitting. Child care. That's the hardest thing for these women to get. And they ... it kind of inhibits them to be able to out and find a job. A lot don't have families that are supportive and will baby sit. Some have small little toddlers and they don't have anyone to watch them or can't pay for day care. So these kids are kind of stuck. They have to go on social services or whatever. Those are the two main things I see as inhibiting them from going out and getting on their own.

HG: You touched on resources. What are some of the ways that victims of domestic violence find themselves obtaining the resources. I know through arrest and whatnot, that's kind of a clear path to getting help. But what about the girls that are in danger? They're too afraid to call the police. What are some ways they can seek help? If they haven't been introduced through the system yet.

AP: Well there is the hotline. There's the domestic violence assistance hotline. It's out there. It's in the phone book. It's in all kinds of advertising. So all they need to do.  Or dial 911.

DH: She's saying without police intervention.

AP: Oh without police intervention. I'm sorry.

HG: If they've been too scared to. Or they don't know that is a resource.

AP: The hotline is the best way to get hooked up with support services. And those are Erie County, Niagara County. I'm sure Susan, I know she does, I get calls all the time just from your name being out there. From people from different counties. The southern tier. They're coming to here. Got your name from somebody. It always astounds me.

DH:DH: I think what Anita is alluding to here is, if they do get her name or they do call us in kind of a blind reporting kind of way, we set them up with the YWCA, which has great programming. Child family service has great programming. Even DSS has great programming without involving the police. And a blind format, peopel do that all the time.

JV: JV: Yeah, there's no shortage out there of help, at all. You can call the YMCA and say, "I'm in a domestic situation and I need help." They will get you to the right spot. There's no shortage.

DH: Without police involvement.

AP: I know you're saying without police involvement, but I have to say most of these officers are very very fluent in referring girls to help. They give them the numbers to call. They give them - they're homeless. They help them. They'll call me. I'll get calls at night from some of the officers wanting to know if a girl can get into the shelter. So these guys have resources themselves that they share with victims.

JV: One phone number that we have is 438-3301. Domestic violence intervention. But that is ... it's not 24/7. So it's important to remember that. And keep in mind anytime we fill out a DIR, a domestic incidence report, which, by the way, is being revamped by the state. Should be out in a couple months. They've actually gone to the police officers and said, "how do we make this form better?" They're rewriting it. It should be out very soon. But ... we give a victim sheet off the back of it. It's a carbon-copy type report and we fill that report out. And we have to do it on scene. And then we rip the back page off and we hand it to the victim. There's all sorts of resources and everything on the back. In two languages. Spanish and English.

DH: People are not afraid to come out now and discuss it. Talk about it because it such a, I don't want to say "hot topic." It's always been there. But now it just seems that it's okay to say that "yeah, this is happening to me. And it happened to Ray Rice or whoever. And let me get the help that I need now to get out of this relationship. But can we do more? Absolutely.

JV: And if you're living with Race and you're raising a baby, you're a 22-year-old girlfriend, wife, whatever. And you're with a guy making $5 million a year in the limelight. It's hard to leave that. It might take a few punches to the face ... and that's sort of the unfortunate part. And you can bring that right down to an incident in the city of Lockport where we've got a young mom who maybe didn't go to college, doesn't work. Dad works maybe over at Delphi, providing for the family. And she's looking, saying "I got nowhere to go. If I leave him, I have noting." And that's what keeps these ladies in these relationships."

AP: It does. But one idea I had. And I'm guilty of procrastinating also this month. I was thinking of having a poster contest with the paper where, throughout the schools. And have a contest with each grade level. Not you know like the middle school. The intermediate, high school ... and you can get some prizes and have them submit their entries. For domestic violence. I though that'd be a good idea for next year.

DH: What's that ... I don't want to call it a run, but ...

AP: Oh the high heel run?

DH: Where the guys ...

JV: I don't wear high heels.

DH: They would seriously need a big high heel. They don't run, but what is it? "Walk a mile in my shoes," where police officers and other people in the community, they wear high heels and walk that mile and I think it's called "Walk a mile in my shoes?"

AP: Right.

DH: And it brings a lot of focus and attention to domestic violence. I think that would be fun. It'd get a huge response. But we just ... it's hard ...

AP: Money is a big thing.

DH: And it's hard to get somebody out there to really organize something of that magnitude. But it would be big. I think it would be fun. Something neat. Something different.

JV: I just want to give you the New York Domestic Violence Hotline. It's 800-942-6906. Multiple languages. Hearing impaired. All that stuff is on there. Someone can call there anytime day or night and depending where they are, we'll get referred to. If it's something criminal in nature, we'll get notified right away. Maybe it's a psychological abuse that's been going on for 20 years and finally she wants to call or he wants to call. That will get people started in the right direction.

AP: And you can give my number out. I mean just like LPD. 439-6630.

DH: That's not manned 24-hours but there is a voice message that's on there.

SL: I think you very much. Heather you set?

HG: I'm set. Thank you.

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